new audio methods and devices -- fact or fiction?

everyones heard about these… some are fact and some may be fiction.

post your comments here!!! post what you know about and have personally tried / heard.

  1. audio spotlight from www.holosonics.com (version soon to be installed in cars for personal zone audio systems?)

  2. HSS similiar to above from american tech corp (cali and texas)

  3. LRAD military and police force weopon… this one is all over the news… has anyone experience it?

  4. FICTION?? “the acoustic heteorodyne” to make sound appear in mid air. there are references to this one on the web, but can anyone shed more light on it???

  5. SIGGRAPH 08 - ultrasound phased array that creates a force in air to “push” paper… fact or fiction?? theres a video on youtube!!!

its a great time to be alive and an engineer.

sometimes new tech blows us away.

i personally am not good at EM waves and know nothing of acoustics!!

so post what you know about the above!! and chime in.

ill add more links later on.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

btw.

you guys all know i have served in the military (and several years in Iraq)… i do not hold any security clearances…

but i have personally witnessed things similiar to #1, #4 and #5 above. (unfortunately not on the right side of things…)

:lol: :lol: :lol:

so post what you know :slight_smile: and we all can get a head start on whats coming up.

I was asked to look into the technology in #1 for the reverse reason.Being able to isolate a conversation in a crowded, noisy room. It does work as advertised. It’s like creating a virtual duct for keeping the sound focused. The down side is that the farther away the target is, the more ultrasonic power you need to reach it. Even if the pressure can’t be heard, it can be sensed at greater power levels.

Ron

hmm never thought of that…

yah #1 is pretty cool.

i hang around the haunt forums around halloween time, and it seems some people ARE using that for haunted houses :slight_smile:

although the cost is prohibitive, and turns some of them away…

here is a conecpt car with “zone audio”… says its based on audio spotlight

http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/storie … rive3.html

good article about LRAD, and other such techs being installed on UAV’s for SOCOM.

this article quotes the LRAD going upto 1400 meters!!! thats crazy!!! and its focused sound.

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2009/08 … nd-system/

this is the youtube video of #5 above…

phased array ultrasound creating a force on paper…

anywhoo…

heres the video

supposedly this was at siggraph 08

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSf2-jm0SsQ

another example

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=a1e_1249948793

ive also read that ultrasound will be used for targeted inside body drug delivery, by using the force generated by it to push fluids.

found tons of patents pending on that and other applications.

this is american technology corps website…

makers of the LRAD and HSS sound systems… (among other things…)

think they moved to cali?? they were in austin texas before… (which is where my ex wife lives coincidently…)

http://www.atcsd.com/site/

heres one of the patents filed by ATC for “acoustical heterodyne” where you can basically make sound appear at a point in space from 2 ultrasonic waves…

http://www.freepatentsonline.com/5889870.html

you can also see their other patents… there are many!!!

theyve been busy little bees.

:lol: :lol:

I bet this acoustical heterodyne is based on the beat frequency created when two waves combine. Easy concept in one dimension, but I still can’t get my head wrapped around the idea in 3D. Always suspected it was just a matter of time…

LOL

you guys are full of puns.

one of these days ill try some of these things out and order a couple.

hmmm welcome to the forum!

:wink: :wink:

I’ve experienced #4 some years ago in university.

IIRC they borrowed a device from Sennheiser’s research division for the show.

ahh Sennheiser! forgot about that company…

yah they do noise cancellation and such… really good with acoustics…

speaking of noise cancellation… i have also personally witnessed a communications method that cant be cancelled with current noise cancellation methods :slight_smile:

it even goes through hearing protection such as shooter grade headphones for when you are at the range…

hmmm thats about all i can say about that one hahahaha.

its all true :slight_smile:

this is the side of engineering that is not commonplace and is hidden.

but its exciting to learn about, that is one of the reasons i have started this thread.

we all should know about this stuff.

can you guys mention any applications for these items?

i know quite a few but they relate to intelligence.

ill post it here in a few days or soo…

you go ahead and think about it a bit.

see if u can figure it out…

remember that intelligence can in some respects (especially domestic intelligence) as a meld of psychology and electronics mixed together… and i am talking about HUMINT (human intelligence) not necessarily SIGINt.

ok i guess nobody is into intelligence applications!! LOL

:lol: :lol: :lol:

well u would never think of this application anyways.

its a new interrogation method (well it may not be new, i really dont know)…

it took me a while to figure this one out… but one day while looking in the mirror with my Ipod headphones on, it just clicked.

it deals with how the brain processes sound.

you can do this test at home by getting a MONO audio track for your ipod or whatever as opposed to a stereo one. now put on the headphones and listen to it. Where does it sound like the sound is coming from? You instantly answer “uhhhh headphones…”… nope! think originally. It sounds like its in the middle.

Well what if we could produce that effect (like a mono audio track) but not using headphones so the intended target doesnt know its there?

then it would appear “in the middle” as before.

i call this the “darwinistic audio effect” becuase we have to rethink how we hear to figure this one out…

This brings up a whole slew of applications.

the main application is a new sleep interrogation technique which can be used in intelligence, and is passive in nature.

the idea is to be the “inside voice” while the person is sleeping, and if you have a suggestive person then you may get some feedback from that person, which could result in a type of “interrogation” for getting information. waiting unti the subject enters REM sleep will result in a totally passive interrogation method.

normally you cant fool the person to be the inside voice while they are awake… but when they sleep you can! If the person is suggestive in nature (as most of us are) they may follow commands in their sleep too so that you can get feedback from questions etc.

yah this stuff is way out there, but it IS used.

try the headphone experiment yourself with MONO audio not stereo. and pretend you dont have headphones on. then ask yourself where the sound is?.. youll say “in the middle”.

this application sounds crazy… but remember, thats what people in intelligence use!!!

they use stuff that sounds crazy.

why?

becuase nobody would ever believe it.

welcome to the world of domestic intelligence.

the next application is related to the previous post.

i also have tons of experience with this.

its making a manchurian candidate.

im sure some of you have read the book and maybe seen the movie “manchurian candidate”…

its every psychologists dream to do this apparantly…

experimental psychology and electronics collide.

it involves using external and internal auditory stimuluses and switching back and forth between the 2 of them. the point is to dull the auditory senses so the person will accept the inside auditory stimulus as their own.

it is imperative to have good coverage and you must say things related to what the person is doing… so you need very good TRV (technical remote viewing) capability.

people in intelligence love to play with these toys… (yah they are toys cause you have to be a kid to sit there and use them…)…

but as lots of you know me, i am an analytical person… sometimes like a computer.

if a brick hit me in the head, i would analyze the events and the subhematoma or concussion that may result… thats just how i am.

thus is my own experience to these events that i analyze and my analysis is this:

  1. you cannot create a true manchurian candidate with the tech mentioned here if the target is not drugged and under hallucinagens.

  2. you may have limited effect in behavioral programming through sleep methods previously described.

  3. it takes YEARS to do this (without hallucinagens)… years of constant 24 hour stimulation both internal and external.

  4. in the near future, it will be possible to create a manchurian candidate using new tech and no hallucinagens no drugs…!!! its true… we need new laws governing the use of these electronics, and the use of psychology.

  5. the exposure to this in the long term (4 years with my data) produces extreme short term memory loss, nervous system damage and some other effects associated to psychosematic and the actual sleeplessness etc of the occuring events.

But with all the stuff the military and its associates are doing right now, there needs to be civilian oversight of ALL experimental psychological operations being conducted in the US. simply becuase they do represent a danger to national security.

i recommend this oversight falls to the Department of Homeland Security as they are well equipped for this regulatory fashion.

also to expand on the tech previously mentioned… it IS possible to create a computer tomography automated system to make sound appear in an XYZ coordinate system given smaller node audio elements using the acoustic heterodyne method above. The area should be mapped out, have visual oversight everywhere, audio mic everywhere for noise analysis, and 24 hour operations being manned and plotted on the “event” board.

It is also possible to use the similiar ultrasonic force devices in tandem with the acoustic heterodyne methods to produce a “3d entity” so to speak… such as a bee buzzing in front of you that has audio but also has the feel of movement…

This tech method will effect the “psychological playground” to be used to make a manchurian candidate.

This tech also brings up tons of morality and ethical issues that need to be addressed.

Also tech wise, what FCC rules cover the emmissions of these devices?

what do we do for victims? what legal action can be taken against the perps.

You could set up a spectrum analyzer in site scanner mode with GPIB and a computer for 24 hour monitoring, i think this is a great method for FCC enforement.

we are not just engineers!!! alot of us are scientists and psychologists and fathers and friends etc…

so many interests… and so little time.