RTK Express not able to seen as base over bluetooth

GPS/GNSS Development Boards
1

Hi!

I am hoping to use my 2 new RTK Express Kits as a base and rover, connected by my cell phone, as I thought I understood was possible from the Sparkfun online information.

But because I am having problems, I have been trying to get either unit to work as a base unit.

Both were fully charged from wall power sockets till their red LED charging lights went off.

Both were able to power on successfully.

I have set both to “base” function, using the “set up” button.

Both report running firmware version 1.9.

No configuration settings have been accessed or adjusted since purchase.

Both were mounted outdoors on stable tripods and have good views of the sky.

When powered up, they will say “base starting”, settle into tracking the satellites, then start “surveying”.

They typically report tracking 27 to 30 satellites.

After 60 seconds with they report typically a location error of under 1.0m and seem to start to report the increasing count of RTCM correction messages supposedly being broadcast.

However on both LCD screens, the top middle icon is a chequered flag, not a castle.

Even after allowing the RTCM message count to exceed 1800 messages, the chequered flag remains displayed and no castle icon is seen.

Q1: does the lack of a castle icon mean that the base function is not operational?

Q2: what do I have to do to get the castle icon displayed?

My Android cell phone has the SW Maps app installed on it.

My cell phone Bluetooth function is able to see both Express units with their correct MAC addresses.

However both Express units are identified in the phone’s Bluetooth pairing menu as “Express- Rover-((MAC address))”, not as base units, despite being set to base mode.

In the SW Maps app, I can connect to the Express units, and they give a status report of “DGPS”, only.

Q3: how do I get the Express units to identify (in Bluetooth) and function (in SW Maps) as base units?

Sorry if I have missed an instruction or solution in the Hook-up Guide, product manual or other forum posts, but I would appreciate your pointing me to the right location or advising what I am doing wrong.

Thanks in advance!

2

Hi,

Many thanks for reporting this. Just a heads-up that Sparky - our RTK expert - is away for a few days. He will reply once he’s back from the wild…

Best wishes,

Paul

3

Hi ADLY, good questions. Sparky is indeed the expert here, but I’ll give it a shot.

Regarding your Q1 and Q2: No, the lack of the castle (“structure”) icon does not mean the base is not operational. If the display says “Xmitting RTCM” and the message count is increasing, the unit is operating in base mode and should be operational and transmitting RTCM messages.

The structure icon is only displayed if you manually provide the exact coordinates of the base station to the base station, typically via the WiFi configuration mode. One common use case is if you have a permanently mounted base (such as on the roof of a structure) that you let transmit RTCM indefinitely (days/weeks/months/years) for use by rovers. Hence the “structure” icon. Another use case for entering exact coordinates (and getting the structure icon) is if you set your base up on a point that you have excellent coordinates for, such as a geodetic survey mark.

If you don’t provide the exact coordinates of the base unit, the flag icon is displayed, first blinking then solid. The base determines approximate coordinates by “surveying in” itself. The base will determine its position within, generally, a few meters. If you get an RTK fix with your rover using this base, the coordinates you get with your rover will be relatively accurate to each other, but will be off in the “real world” by the same general few meters your base is. This is very useful for measuring distances and bearings between points, determining areas of land parcels, etc.

The online product manual isn’t crystal clear, but it does say “The Fixed Base mode is similar but uses a structure icon (shown above) to indicate a fixed base.” The display photos only show the structure icon when transmitting RTCM messages in Fixed Base Mode (indeed the caption of the photo showing the structure does say it’s in fixed mode.) It would be a little clearer if it also has a display photo of a base in survey in mode transmitting RTCM messages. I was also initially confused when I first got my units - my brain was asking “oh why doesn’t my unit look like the photo in the manual under the big heading ‘Base Transmitting’.”

https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … -survey-in

In summary, unless you provide the base unit the exact coordinates you want it to use as it’s current location, it will go into base mode using approximate coordinates, display a flag, and begin transmitting RTCM messages.

If you provide the exact coordinates you want it to use (e.g. via WiFi configuration), you’ll get the structure icon.

Regarding your Q3: Just ignore the “Rover” in the bluetooth name. The name of the device doesn’t (based on my testing with my pair of SPE RTK ) change to “… Base” when the unit is running in base mode. Honestly, it’d be less confusing if the Bluetooth names were something like “SPE RTK Express-NNNN” or “SPE RTK Facet-NNNN”.

One more note: You didn’t mention what communication channel you setup for the RTCM messages to flow from your base to your rover. You need to provide a communication channel. Wires, a telemetry radio pair, or internet connections are common channels uses. I typically work in an area with no cellular or internet access, so I use a pair of the 900 MHz telemetry radios.

4

Again, thanks Tony and Paul for covering for me while on vacation!

Tony - You’ve got it nailed.

Hi ADLY -

Q3: how do I get the Express units to identify (in Bluetooth) and function (in SW Maps) as base units?

This sounds like a bug. I’ll double check that the firmware is behaving.

(From https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … h/#android): When powered on, the RTK product will broadcast itself as either ‘[Platform] Rover-5556’ or ‘[Platform] Base-5556’ depending on which state it is in. [Platform] is Facet, Express, Surveyor, etc.

You are running v1.9 of the firmware which should be fine. I don’t believe any of your issues are firmware related. However, I do recommend upgrading the firmware if you have the opportunity to. We regularly add features and new enhancements so the documentation may not reflect your reality.

5

Hi toeknee!

Thank you!

Your reply really cleared up a lot for me!

I now understand that with the SPE Base unit displaying a Flag, it is effectively operating in a “GNSS single” mode that it self-determines where it is (SparkFun’s “surveying in” stage).

And only if I externally supply separately, accurately determined coordinates to tell the Base where it is, then it will go to “Fixed” mode, and display the “castle/structure” icon.

And thanks for telling me to ignore the “rover” name description: one of my SPE units has recently occasionally started calling itself “facet” (and I never bought a “facet” unit) … :blush: … so now I know to ignore the naming and go only with the last 4 ID letters of the MAC address.

I am sorry for not acknowledging and thanking you earlier, but I have been trying to get the base and rover working together. No success so far, so I would appreciate any guidance you (or indeed anyone else) might offer, please.

Q4: Am I correct in expecting that the SPE Base should be able to speak to the SPE Rover only via a local (i.e. no internet connection) Bluetooth connection, using my Samsung A20S Andriod phone, yes?

I appreciate that the range would be severely restricted to Bluetooth’s range.

I have been trying to use Android’s “SW Maps” app.

When I connect SWM to the base, or the rover, via bluetooth, another option in the SW main menu comes up: “NTRIP Connection”.

But I am unable to create this connection: I cannot locate an online source to advise me what I should use for port, mount point, user name and password.

Q5. Can you advise a URL that can tell me how to do this, please?

Q6. Am I correct in expecting that the SPE Base should be able to speak to the SPE Rover only via a local (i.e. no internet connection) Wi-Fi connection, yes?

Similarly, could you point me to a URL that will give me pointers, please?

I understand that I should be able to get the base to issue RTK corrections to the rover via an internet-based NTRIP caster, but I would like to see if I can do it only locally first, please, as some of the areas I operate in may not have a stable mobile data service.

(Yes… I also bought telemetry radios, but was hoping to use a cell phone local service only as a simple initial step in learning about the SPE….)

Thanks, again, in advance!

6

Hi Sparky,

I see other users have been able to get the SPE units to work well in RTK as base/rover, but I will try the Firmware update!

Thanks!

7

Q4: Am I correct in expecting that the SPE Base should be able to speak to the SPE Rover only via a local (i.e. no internet connection) Bluetooth connection, using my Samsung A20S Andriod phone, yes?

No; corrections are not broadcast over Bluetooth, only via a radio connected to the radio port, or via WiFi from the base, to an NTRIP Caster. The rover is then connected via Bluetooth to a phone, that gets its correction data from the NTRIP caster via the cellular network. These images and information may help clear things up: https://www.sparkfun.com/pages/rtk

Q5. Can you advise a URL that can tell me how to do this, please?

To setup a base: https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … gure_base/

To setup a rover: https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … rip-client

Creating an NTRIP caster: https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … rip-caster

Q6. Am I correct in expecting that the SPE Base should be able to speak to the SPE Rover only via a local (i.e. no internet connection) Wi-Fi connection, yes?

Direct WiFi between Rover and Base = no. The base will need an internet connection via WiFi, to use WiFi to an NTRIP Caster. A direct connection between Rover and Base is currently only possible with an external telemetry radio.

The Bluetooth broadcast as ‘Rover’ bug was fixed in release v2.3.

8

Sparky,

Thanks! Will get into it!

ADLY

9

Hello Sparky,

I have been trying to update the firmware on my Sparkfun RTK Express unit.

I have successfully downloaded the latest firmware file I could find “RTK_Surveyor_Firmware_v2_3.bin” onto the SD card and put the SD card into the SRE unit.

The SRU unit was connected from its “Config ESP32” USB C port to my PC’s USB port.

I was able to create a 115200 baud Com port connection between the PC and SRE, using Tera Term.

The text between the lines of dots below is a copy of the terminal window’s display.

…………………………………………………

…………………………………………………

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 201486 - Generation rate: 0.0kB/s - Write speed: 0.0kB/s

w

SparkFun RTK Express v1.9-Dec 8 2021

** Bluetooth broadcasting as: Express Rover-9D2E **

Menu: Main Menu

  1. Configure GNSS Receiver

  2. Configure GNSS Messages

  3. Configure Base

  4. Configure Ports

  5. Configure Logging

  6. Display microSD contents

d) Configure Debug

r) Reset all settings to default

f) Firmware upgrade

x) Exit

r

Resetting to factory defaults. Press ‘y’ to confirm:

ySettings erased successfully. Rebooting. Good bye!

ets Jul 29 2019 12:21:46

rst:0xc (SW_CPU_RESET),boot:0x13 (SPI_FAST_FLASH_BOOT)

configsip: 0, SPIWP:0xee

clk_drv:0x00,q_drv:0x00,d_drv:0x00,cs0_drv:0x00,hd_drv:0x00,wp_drv:0x00

mode:DIO, clock div:1

load:0x3fff0030,len:1240

load:0x40078000,len:13012

load:0x40080400,len:3648

entry 0x400805f8

ZED-F9P firmware: HPG 1.13

SparkFun RTK Express v1.9-Dec 8 2021

Reset reason: ESP_RST_SW

microSD online

EEPROM is blank. Default settings applied

MAX17048 configuration complete

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

Updating UART1 rate

Updating UART2 rate

GNSS configuration complete

Accelerometer configuration complete

WiFi Stopped

Bluetooth broadcasting as: Express Rover-9D2E

State: Rover - No Fix

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

Appending last available log

Log file created: SFE_Express_220804_214702.ubx

UBX file size: 201517 - Generation rate: 40.3kB/s - Write speed: 56226.8kB/s

Batt (100%): Voltage: 4.19V Discharging: 0.00%/hr Green

UBX file size: 208197 - Generation rate: 1.3kB/s - Write speed: 1214.3kB/s

w

SparkFun RTK Express v1.9-Dec 8 2021

** Bluetooth broadcasting as: Express Rover-9D2E **

Menu: Main Menu

  1. Configure GNSS Receiver

  2. Configure GNSS Messages

  3. Configure Base

  4. Configure Ports

  5. Configure Logging

  6. Display microSD contents

d) Configure Debug

r) Reset all settings to default

f) Firmware upgrade

x) Exit

f

Menu: Update Firmware Menu

  1. Load RTK_Surveyor_Firmware_v2_3.bin

x) Exit

11

WiFi Stopped

Bluetooth turned off

Loading RTK_Surveyor_Firmware_v2_3.bin

Update begin failed. Not enough partition space available.

Menu: Update Firmware Menu

  1. Load RTK_Surveyor_Firmware_v2_3.bin

x) Exit

No user input received.

………………………………….

………………………………….

Essentially, after not being able to update the firmware, I disconnected all, and re-started.

I reset settings to default: this appears to have been successful.

But when I try to load the firmware update, I get the error message “Update begin failed. Not enough partition space available.”

The text below between the lines of dots is the directory listing of the SD card.

………………………………….

………………………………….

Volume in drive H has no label.

Volume Serial Number is 6339-3361

Directory of H:\

01/01/2021 12:00 am 3,466 SFE_Express_Settings.txt

04/08/2022 09:34 pm 2,049,049 SFE_Express_220804_205441.ubx

04/08/2022 05:57 pm 1,997,360 RTK_Surveyor_Firmware_v2_3.bin

04/08/2022 09:44 pm 609,960 SFE_Express_220804_213511.ubx

04/08/2022 09:45 pm 32,323 SFE_Express_220804_214511.ubx

04/08/2022 10:12 pm 225,565 SFE_Express_220804_214702.ubx

8 File(s) 4,917,757 bytes

0 Dir(s) 31,897,255,936 bytes free

………………………………….

………………………………….

The card seems to have the correct .bin files

Could you please advise how to get past this, please?

Thanks,

ADLY

10

Hi ADLY - you will need to use the GUI or CLI methods to update your firmware from v1.x to v2.x. Below is mentioned on all the firmware release pages.

If you’re on windows, the GUI is the easiest path: https://docs.sparkfun.com/SparkFun_RTK_ … indows-gui

Note: If you are currently using version 1.x firmware you will need to load v2.x firmware using a USB connection (SD and WiFi are not supported). We have created a Windows GUI to ease this process. Please see Updating Firmware from GUI for a step by step process. Once you’ve updated to v2.x firmware, you will be able to load future firmware using any method (SD, WiFi, USB, or GUI).

11

Sparky!

Sorry for the delay in replying, but thanks very much for your guidance: I was able to successfully update the firmware, and have been busy having great fun with the base and rover, getting comfortable with operating them… :slight_smile: They are delightfully light weight!

A minor comment… perhaps you may wish to consider in future hardware versions: put the connections at the bottom of the unit so that rain does not automatically drip into the unit. Apologies if my ignorance of the design details of the innards of the units do not allow this.

I would appreciate your assistance with two questions please:

(1) when I move the rover too far from the base and loose RTK radio connectivity, is the rover supposed to re-establish connection on its own if/when it is back in range of the base’s radio? So far, I have had to power off, and then on, on the rover, to re-establish radio connection, as reported by SW Maps. Or is there another setting I could adjust to allow the rover to automatically connect back again?

(2) is there a way I can get the actual H and V accuracy associated with a particular data point when recorded by SW Maps, to be recorded and listed with the actual point XYZ coordinates?

Or is there another software tat can do this?

Thanks and regards,

ADLY

12

I’m using two Facets connected with the 100mW Holybro telemetry radios. If I lose the telemetry radio connection, I lose RTK Fix. If I move the rover closer to the base, the radios automatically reconnect and I automatically get an RTK Fix again. I do not need to power cycle anything.

The Holybro radios have a green LED that is solid when the radios are connected. The green LED blinks slowly and steadily when the radios lose connection. The red LED blinks briefly when data is moving between the radios and the Facet.